exxos's Atari, Amiga & retro forum

russellnash wrote: 12 Aug 2024 09:19 That is good to know. I removed a badge once because the corner had lifted but I immediately wished I hadn't because it put kinks in the metal and bits of paint came off.

The best way to remove is to heat from behind the badge gently to soften the adhesive. There are sometimes holes to push the badge out from behind once the adhesive is soft.

alexh wrote: 12 Aug 2024 09:22

stween wrote: 11 Aug 2024 19:27 Personally: I've never gone near the approaches that seem to require creams and cling film etc.

The hydrogen peroxide cream + TAED + clingfilm "in my experience" gets you a much more even result than fluid based Retr0Bright. It is counter intuitive but empirical tests (for me) show far less "streaks"

I find it odd that you've got streaks when using submersion, I'd have though streaks are more likely with creams applied unevenly, but I guess as with everything it's ultimately how you apply the process and anything can fail if applied incorrectly.

alexh wrote: 12 Aug 2024 09:22 However it is extremely easy to over Retr0Bright using the cream method if you have no patience because you have to remove the cream at periodic intervals for colour match testing and then re-apply if it needs longer. You can be tempted to "leave it a bit longer" to save time and money and before you know it you've gone too far.

With the fluid based Retr0Bright you can just take it out of the fluid to compare and if it needs longer pop it back in.

That's an excellent point for sure.

rubber_jonnie wrote: 12 Aug 2024 10:12 I find it odd that you've got streaks when using submersion, I'd have though streaks are more likely with creams applied unevenly, but I guess as with everything it's ultimately how you apply the process and anything can fail if applied incorrectly.

I think it was to do with variable light conditions combined with the Retr0Bright delivery system.

If you're using sunlight (as I was) and the immersion period is long (as mine was), light will vary across item. (e.g. clouds, shadows). With the cream, once the reaction is complete there is no more Retr0Bright but with immersion it can continue to react indefinitely as the fluid is all around, if you add in variable UV from sunlight that could mean variable Retr0Bright effect?

Also I didn't use a closed container (as I worried that the plastic lid might block UV) so it might have been something as simple as ripples across the fluid caused by wind.

alexh wrote: 12 Aug 2024 10:29

rubber_jonnie wrote: 12 Aug 2024 10:12 I find it odd that you've got streaks when using submersion, I'd have though streaks are more likely with creams applied unevenly, but I guess as with everything it's ultimately how you apply the process and anything can fail if applied incorrectly.

I think it was to do with variable light conditions combined with the Retr0Bright delivery system?

If you're using sunlight as I was and the immersion period is long, light will vary across item. (e.g. clouds, shadows) Also I didn't use a closed container (as I worried that the plastic lid might block UV) so it might have been something as simple as ripples across the fluid caused by wind.

With the cream, once the reaction is complete there is no more Retr0Bright but with immersion it can continue to react indefinitely as the fluid is all around, if you add in variable UV from sunlight that could mean variable Retr0Bright effect?

Possibly, but at the moment we're having cloudless sunny days round here, with little wind, plus our back garden is reasonably protected from the wind, so it's not an issue, but certainly these could be a factor.

I'm not using a closed container either as the lid would block everything, but you could I suppose use cling film if you wanted to.

I do like the lack of mess with the water based method though.

Look forward to seeing your results.

I tried different strengths of H2O2 but ultimately the strongest I could get worked the best. But obviously safety becomes an issue, gloves and safety glasses, wash hands after removing gloves etc. One rub of the eye and ....

Also using H2O2 on it's own and not adding TAED (vanish whitening) lowers the results / increases the exposure time considerably.

Not sure if everyone remembers my investigations into it all as well viewtopic.php?p=5639

rubber_jonnie wrote: 12 Aug 2024 10:12 [I find it odd that you've got streaks when using submersion, I'd have though streaks are more likely with creams applied unevenly, but I guess as with everything it's ultimately how you apply the process and anything can fail if applied incorrectly.

It's less to do with uneven application than variable reaction rate due to spacial variation in the plastic chemistry.

I've found the Atari plastics to be poorly mixed and highly resistant to brightening, except in streaks along the plastic flow lines. I've not had this difficulty with any other plastics.

stephen_usher wrote: 12 Aug 2024 13:29

rubber_jonnie wrote: 12 Aug 2024 10:12 [I find it odd that you've got streaks when using submersion, I'd have though streaks are more likely with creams applied unevenly, but I guess as with everything it's ultimately how you apply the process and anything can fail if applied incorrectly.

It's less to do with uneven application than variable reaction rate due to spacial variation in the plastic chemistry.

I've found the Atari plastics to be poorly mixed and highly resistant to brightening, except in streaks along the plastic flow lines. I've not had this difficulty with any other plastics.

Whilst I don't disagree, I would suggest that different layer thicknesses of creme might affect the level of UV getting through, which was what happened when I tried the original retrobrite formula and it was clear that the thicker parts blocked UV from getting through.

The original Retr0bright circa 2008-2010 was a liquid.

alexh wrote: 12 Aug 2024 16:17 The original Retr0bright circa 2008-2010 was a liquid.

I found the original article I worked from, and it describes it as a gel: Original Retr0brite

This is what I made and it was:

1. Not fun to make.
2. Not easy to apply.
3. Not successful for me

On that last note, it's fair to say others may have had much better luck than me, but I tried to follow the instructions exactly and the results weren't good. Your mileage may vary as with anything like this.

I suspect that ultimately what you're making is similar to H2O2 cremes, but much more 'made in my shed' so not quite as consistent.